Hospital Merger Documents Withheld

http://www.leesburg2day.com/current.cfm?catid=28&newsid=10280

This article in Leesburg Today makes it clear that Loudoun
Hospital and Inova are hiding something but what do they have
to hide?

Loudoun Hospital is a non-profit hospital. From what I can
tell, Inova did not pay anything to LHI. All they gave were
promises to spend money at some unspecified time in the future
and a golden parachute for CEO Rod Huebbers.

Is this a fair deal that benefits the citizens of Loudoun?
What is Loudoun Hospital worth? Did the board get a fair price
for it? How firm are the commitments to invest? Who decides
how and when it gets invested? If it is a good deal, why is
it secret?

In the non-profit world, disclosure is the rule. LHI was
organized as a non-profit public entity to benefit the citizens
of Loudoun. They should not be hiding the details this merger or
Huebbers compensation for making the deal.

Huebbers annual compensation of over $500,000 - double what a CEO
of a for profit hospital typically makes - is unreasonable for a
non-profit:
http://www.ama-assn.org/amednews/2003/11/03/bise1103.htm
My guess is that he is profiting obscenely from this deal.

The fact that they won't disclose the detailed terms of the merger
makes it clear to me that its a rotten one.

 

Read the whole article: the documents include items from board meetings which are not open to the public, hence those inclusions are not open just because they're in another document that the agency reviewing them may need to see to rule on whether the merger is legit or not. The merger has been ruled legit, and it is the state agency that is withholding certain documents, not either principal in the merger. Now, is it okay for state officials (like Stroube) to withhold information required to be released by law when granting a (now-reversed) COPN, and NOT okay for other state officials to withhold information deemed confidential by law?

Barbara Munsey, from South Riding.

 

I read the entire article. Perhaps you did not. It says:

"LHI also declined to release the documents."

I was not referring to board meeting notes. I was talking
about releasing the merger agreement, agreement requiring Huebbers
retention and commitment letter to employ Turner as general
counsel which are mentioned in the article. The merger agreement
of a public non-profit is not proprietary. Nor is Huebbers
compensation.

Again, what do they have to hide?

There is no evidence that Stroube deliberately left that
document out of the record or that the document was the
tipping point in his decision. The judge ordered him to
reconsider the COPN's and we will have his new/final decision
in 90 days.

 

Yes, I read it. The AG only released some of the docs, because some contained info that is confidential. Then it says that LHI didn't release them either. Implying to me that after the state didn't, they aksed the hospital, who said no thanks, as they are allowed to do under state law, which is why the AG's office didn't release them in the first place.

If it was no big deal that Dr. Stroube didn't follow legal procedure for the COPN process, why was it ruled reversible error and in fact reversed? Let's not fight about this; it seemed from your post that you hadn't focused on the fact that the state didn't do the releasing, and there are legal reasons for what was and wasn't released. To my knowledge, not only does BRMC not currently have a COPN, neither do they have a currently active application. Let's see what happens next.

Barbara Munsey, from South Riding.

 

I am amazed Barbara how you have turned this around to be an anti-BRMC posting. What exactly are your ties with INOVA/LHI??? Maybe your name will pop up in the spider web soon!

 

so, anybody against BRMC must have ties to INOVA? you guys ARE kinda paranoid. Lots of sane people think it's idiotic to put a second hospital within 10 mile of an existing one in a county this size. (And you can't blame a resident of south riding for being in that camp)

 

What do you mean by a county of this size? By the time a hospital (any hospital) gets approved and then built, how big do you think Loudoun will be then? Or have you not noticed the growth in this county the past 5-10 years.

 

Sox: no ties to LHI other than that a relative was treated there (successfully) a little over a year ago. No ties to Inova other than that Fair Oaks stiched up a gash on my son about six years ago, and took a Tart 'n Tiny out of his nose a year or so before that.

Anti-BRMC post? Facts please? It blows my mind all the activity recently about BRMC, when currently they have no site, no active application, and no COPN. As I said, let's see what happens.

You may be right about the spider web--plenty of shadowy blanks to be filled in, and the level of hysteria and innuendo on that site probably has plenty of room for me, since it appears to be proving to be connected to the bogus PEC Campaign for the Future, and we all know how very much I love PEC. I'm equally sure they love me right back!

Barbara Munsey, from South Riding.

 

T8erman...according to population stats at the county web site...we're projected to have a population of about 312,000 by the year 2010. Let's hope we're not left with only Loudoun Hospital at that time.

Barbara…according to the anti-hospital group, “It is not unusual for an entity to obtain zoning prior to other regulatory authority for a project. LHI has done this in the past.”

No site? Not sure what you mean by that.

No COPN – they haven’t withdrawn their application. They’ll have it back in May.

Did you happen to see Scott York’s letter to the editor in the Post yesterday? Well written letter with some good questions. Just how does Inova define “when needed” when referring to the hospital they are promising along Rt. 50? I know you told me it’s none of my business…but, I still am curious as to how the SPC addressed this when they voted to oppose BRMC to the BOS. Are they still representing themselves as Dulles South, or did they decide to just go with South Riding on this resolution to oppose?

Zansu…not insane to put a hospital where it is central to more than 75% of the county’s population...especially when that county's population is quickly approaching 250,000. If you checked out the Madison Retail Group web site referenced in the Future Developments around Broadlands thread, they are calling Loudoun Station “Loudoun County’s new Downtown”. BRMC...located only minutes from "Downtown"...pretty good location for a hospital, don’t you think?

 

Jeanne.....How nice to see you again.......I figured you'd be back............now that there...appears...to be a...concerted...campaign to somehow...address...the BRMC issue even though it is...not...on any agenda this week........

Sorry, I couldn't resist.

Since you seem to better with simple formats Jeanne:

1) Population stats do no good if they are inaccurate. The stats used by BRMC for the route 50 corridor are based on the previous administration's assertion that "there would be no further growth" here, by their own admission at their presentation to us (and do I have to post the links here for round three or do you remember discussing this ad nauseam on now-four threads?).

2) Funny, wasn't the song that the COPN "proved" the need to give the zoning, before the COPN was reversed? As if the state somehow controlled local land use?

3) For the umpteenth time: HCA has purchased adjacent parcels which do not list hospital as a use by-right, and only one of which lists it as a special exception. If the bundle of applications are all approved that will create a single parcel with appropriate zoning, THEN they will have a site. All they have right now is pieces of land and a lot of "ifs".

4) Sorry, but the COPN was reversed, because the judge found "reversible error" on appeal. That means that currently they have no COPN. Maybe they'll get it back. Maybe not. But right now they don't have one.

5) Yes, I saw the letter, and I've got my own guesses on who wrote it. Interesting that he used the PEC/CLF version of the acronym CPAM, to define it incorrectly as a "Comprehensive Plan Developer Amendment", which fits right in with the spiderweb loose (cannon) threads.

6) I said the workings of the SPC are none of your business, and they aren't unless you choose to move in and volunteer. You have to attend three meetings within a six-month period to attain voting privileges, and there is a capped membership so move fast if you want to gain access to more of our HOA business than you can gather on our website. For the umpteenth time, we do not represent ourselves as Dulles South, have not, and will not. We are the largest single community in the Dulles magisterial district, but we don't say we represent the district either. By all means continue to beat that horse if it makes you feel better, but I doubt it will get you anywhere specific.

7) Your straw here supports the "smart" growth aspects of the hospital issue--we must have transit oriented development is we are to show good faith on wanting transit, and then if we use the not-realized in our lifetimes transit density to justify placement of services, we can direct growth to the Jamestown Compact's private toll road, and continue to follow a policy of attrition everywhere else. Did you read the front page of the Post today? "Smart" growth is in a shiver because Portland, the bastion and beacon of social engineering through land use, passed a law that will have large repercussions. If you read it, I'd love to discuss it with you.

Sorry to go on so long. Bye...for now...

Barbara Munsey, from South Riding.

 

Barbara, you always lose your civility when confronted with uncomfortable questions and facts. I think your rude response to Jeanne warrants an apology.

I am beginning to smell a rat. Who are you fronting for? You confidently spew LHC/INOVA facts, as gospel. Are you getting fed inside "talking points"? Who is "spinning" your top? Your righteous stance seems to be emboldened by other entities, or I am totally underestimating your ego.

Oh ya, I guess it's time for you to mention that we are both outsiders and it's not appropriate for us to talk like this as guests.

 

No, AFGM, I don't think I'll apologize unless I get an order from an Admin to do so. My reference to things like "simple" format are only repetitions of Jeanne's previous snide iterations of the same phrase to me. If I need to post the link I will.

And that is what it's really all about, isn't it? Cheap formulaic agitprop: Start new thread, post partial truths and outright untruths as if they were in fact true, then chime in in chorus for the sake of any new audience members who might believe some of it, and pretend at every turn that the desperate fictions (there is an appropriate site with proper zoning, the judge's ruling was just a little glitch, what do you mean no COPN?) are true. Then of course the biggie: attack anyone who disagrees, with the accusation that they are paid to think what they do. Maybe you should go back and see the two places on previous threads where Jeanne admits she was employed by HCA? But of course, that wouldn't fit the formula to remember any inconvenient facts like that, eh?

I will apologize for making you feel bad, perhaps with those ellipses in my opener? Maybe it is just the way it reads to me, but Jeanne's stylistic use of constant ellipses gives her posts (at least visually, in my opinion. Maybe she doesn't intend it, but I think she does) a supercilious and insinuating tone that is aggravated by some things she shares with you: a tendency to pretend that propaganda is fact, and a very good sense of forgettery. The same lies have been floated by both of you more than once, and her insistence on lying about our HOA committees is not going anywhere with me. And lying is what she is doing, and has done more than once, if we go around the mulberry bush yet again with "claiming to speak for Dulles South", just as we have done multiple times with things like "the minutes show no attendance by HCA", and so on.

Tell me, unless you are pretending not to have extensive knowledge of HOA workings today, how ridiculous is it for her to get huffy about what is discussed in a committee of a community she doesn't live in? Shall I demand non-resident access to the business of Broadlands or Farm HOA committees? I don't think so, because it doesn't work that way.

Of course I have an ego. As if you don't? As if Jeanne doesn't? How on earth could the two of you play the games you do, make the accusations you do, and pretend the house of cards you want everyone to live in is a brick house if you DIDN'T have some major chutzpah?

Earth to AFGM: I'm not fronting for anybody. I don't need to get "fed" "talking points (Mr. Talking Point) because the aspects of this issue that make me smell a great big rat are things I've been studying for eight years now. I think what I think, and it does not agree with your formula. Do you and Jeanne plan to apologize any time soon for following that formula of "Package lie in new wrapper, etc etc etc", the rude insinuations and lofty omissions, and the constant attacks when your poor propaganda fails again? Mind you, I'm not planning on holding my breath waiting.

By the way, were you two up there in blue shirts with signs last night, carrying on about a non-issue that wasn't even on the agenda? If so, did you see me up there in my little uniform shirt, getting my printout of bull for the week? I don't think you did, did you?

Barbara Munsey, from South Riding.

 

I'm sorry but, how stupid is it to put a hospital on a site where the major access road is a toll road where to exit you need either a speed pass or a credit card? The other roads around the hospital are not adequate for the purpose.

lyo

 

Judging from the way this has been dragging on, we can pretty much guarantee that in 2010 we will still be stuck with only one hospital.

I am pro hospital but I must admit that is a very good point. I guess if they require that there actually be a toll collector at the booth it would be no different than Reston hospital off the toll road. I wonder if there is any provision for this?

 

OP Dude - not sure about that, since currently we have to pay a toll to get to Reston Hospital, Fair Oaks Hospital and Fairfax Hospital if we want to get there via the quickest route.

 

My, Barbara, afgm must have hit a nerve with you. So sorry my writing style annoys you; however, I’m not trying to prove anything. It’s just the way I type. And just so that I don’t set you off, I’ll avoid using them in this post. So glad that these forums provide you a platform to vent. I’m going to keep with the rules of the forum, please see #8 – Be Kind. I won’t attack your character.
Please feel free to send your criticisms directly to me via e-mail. My profile allows you to do that; whereas, yours does not.

Barbara, let me share with you what Inova stated when I called them to ask them when they are going to build that hospital on Route 50, since you keep avoiding this question. They said it would be “at least 10 years before they would consider putting a hospital there because (gasp, can you believe they said this?) there is currently no population in that area to support a hospital.” I guess she’s right, Barbara. An area that has an average of 13 patients a day and that is currently served through Fair Oaks and Fairfax hardly warrants a full service hospital.

Here are a few more questions for you. Is the hospital on Rt. 50 contingent upon the approval of Greenvest’s 14,500 housing unit CPAM? Is Greenvest one of the developers who generously contributed to the Republican Committee or the individuals running for the BOS? Isn’t Randy Minchew the head of the Republican Committee? Doesn’t Minchew sit on Loudoun Hospital’s board, and doesn’t he also serve as an attorney for LHI? Did Greenvest really purchase property from Roma Dawson, who at one time was going to sue Loudoun County over zoning issues because she wanted to sell the family farm for development in an area that was part of the transitional area? Was Roma Dawson really Steve Snow’s campaign treasurer? So, is all of this behind the real reason why BRMC is having such a difficult time obtaining local approval? You know, having said all of that makes me want to break out in song. Join me, Barbara, won’t you? You remember the story of I Know an Old Lady Who Swallowed a Fly? Let’s change the words to I Know a Hospital that Wanted a Monopoly. Come on, Barbara, don’t be bashful, you know all the verses, I’ll help you with the chorus!

Barbara, you are correct. I stated that I was employed by HCA. The key word is “WAS”. I do, however, continue to support their efforts to bring a much needed hospital to our county.

Barbara, you seem to have contradicted yourself. You stated in one of these threads that you wouldn’t be waving a banner to the BOS to oppose BRMC; yet, you are a member of a committee that voted to recommend to your HOA to oppose BRMC. Oh, I guess that’s not you, directly. You’re letting the HOA hold the banner for you. Does this mean we can’t believe everything you say? Oh, I shouldn’t have gone there. You HOA is none of my business. Now, Barbara, won't you join me in singing, Let There be Peace on Forums.

 

This is high comedy...

 

The county needs a hospital, that's not in debate. The Broadlands does not need a hospital. Every argument made about population is moot since nobody seems to mention population density. The 5 mile seperation simply isn't warranted based on population density. Other parts of the county need the hospital more. Why isn't that the real argument?

 

Mearen,

Let me get this straight. You don't want a hospital in Broadlands. You also, as posted in the FAA thread don't want expansion at Dulles. Did you really think this community was going to stop in time once you moved in? What would be appropriate? Something will be coming.

 

Outstanding. The use of paragraphs is effective. See...Jeanne can teach you something.