1. Yes, it's a whole new look! Have questions or need help? Please post your question in the New Forum Questions thread Click the X to the right to dismiss this notice
    Dismiss Notice
  2. Seeing tons of unread posts after the upgrade? See this thread for help. Click the X to the right to dismiss this notice
    Dismiss Notice

Outside Pool Memberships

Discussion in 'Broadlands Community Issues' started by Brosowalk, May 30, 2006.

  1. msflynn

    msflynn New Member

    Joined:
    Jul 15, 2002
    Messages:
    1,095
    Likes Received:
    2
    Good idea but the lawyers do not like that kind of stuff it is considered discrimination. We would be better to sell a pass that did not start until after July 4th or one that did not start until August. Like I said I will keep on top of it for the summer and really track numbers again this summer and see what kind of impact the outside members have and when

    Staci
     
  2. neilz

    neilz New Member

    Joined:
    Dec 7, 2003
    Messages:
    2,547
    Likes Received:
    0
    Just a quick note here from one of the board members who voted for passes again this year.

    Summerbrook Pool is NOT included on the outside membership pass. This pool is strictly for residents, and is not affected by the outside passes at all.
     
  3. flynnibus

    flynnibus Well-Known Member Forum Staff

    Joined:
    Oct 29, 2002
    Messages:
    5,358
    Likes Received:
    250
    Feel free to review the budget which outlines how much revenue we get from the outside pool passes. It's a program well into the BLACK.
     
  4. flynnibus

    flynnibus Well-Known Member Forum Staff

    Joined:
    Oct 29, 2002
    Messages:
    5,358
    Likes Received:
    250
    You missed the point where she said they guage it based on the pools USAGE, not just who picks up passes.
    The excess capacity and need for additional revenue is the justification for selling the outside passes.. and its reviewed each year. You are focusing in on something that was not the root of your original problem. The board doesn't make decisions in a vacuum. You are welcome to attend meetings and make your case as well.
     
  5. flynnibus

    flynnibus Well-Known Member Forum Staff

    Joined:
    Oct 29, 2002
    Messages:
    5,358
    Likes Received:
    250
    As previously stated.. its reviewed every year. Its too late to change it now obviously for this season.. as passes have already been sold.
     
  6. flynnibus

    flynnibus Well-Known Member Forum Staff

    Joined:
    Oct 29, 2002
    Messages:
    5,358
    Likes Received:
    250
    The comment was that ALL memberships (both residents and non) would have a new card system. If outside memberships are sold will be reviewed by the board before next season. 'without consulting residents' is only true for those residents who don't take the initiative to respond to the proposed budget mailings, the notices in the newsletters, and those who do not attend any of the meetings or contact the board or committees to voice their concern.
     
  7. Brosowalk

    Brosowalk New Member

    Joined:
    Mar 17, 2006
    Messages:
    33
    Likes Received:
    0
    Steve, Staci originally said "The reasons that we do outside pool memberships is because each year over 500 homes do not pick up their memberships." So I don't think I missed the point at all. And of course this program is in the black because Broadlands residents pay their HOA dues funding the supposed additional capacity, which is really the issue here. The primary point being that one Broadlands resident turned away from use of one of their community's ammenities on any day because perceived additional capacity was purchased by a non-resident is inexcuseable.
     
  8. Mr. Linux

    Mr. Linux Senior Member & Moderator Forum Staff

    Joined:
    Jul 26, 2001
    Messages:
    3,277
    Likes Received:
    69
    Seriously folks, how many of the people here that are complaining have actually looked at the revenue generated by these passes, in exchange for the 'inconvinience' of having less than 5% of the people in the pool at one time be outsiders? For the folks who are complaining, would you be willing to have our dues raised next year, and the following years, in order to maintain these pools, and expand their amenities?

    Finally, many of you are basing this 'issue' on what happened over the past weekend. Should all HOA decisions be based on a small set of events, or should they be made by looking at the situation as a whole; in this case, usage over the past years?

    Additionally, the fact that 500 homes did *not* pick up their passes *is* statistically significant. When looking at usage patterns, you need to look at the maximum usage probabilities. So for example , if in the past years, usage was at 40% of outstanding passes and 1000 homes picked up their passes, that gives us a number of 400. If the following year we up the usage to 45% but only 800 homes pick up their passes, that gives us 360. That's equivalent to a 10% decrease, which can be made up by non-residents. Please, don't focus on my numbers; just think about the logic.

    Also, keep in mind that the number of passes that were picked up is just ONE of the variables that is taken into consideration when deciding if non-resident passes will be sold. USAGE is the biggest variable used... Staci was simply trying to give you examples of what is used to make the decision; don't focus on one point, look at the whole picture...

    Just putting in my 2 cents here; I honestly feel bad if some of you got turned away over the weekend. But to me, the alternative (raising monthly HOA dues) would be a much greater issue.

    And to all those who still feel that the HOA is making a bad move, how many of you were present at the last HOA meeting/election? Couldn't make it, when it was announced months ahead of time? Couldn't find a pen and a stamp for the Proxy vote? Still disagree with the Board? Go to a meeting and discuss it... Sitting at home in front of your computer, venting your frustrations is one thing, doing something about it is another.

    I know I'm going to take some heat for saying this, but if you couldn't take the time to vote for the 2 Board seats a few weeks ago and ask them how they felt about this issue, feel free to keep complaining about all this, with the thought that you had your chance to vote for a possible better candidate and you did nothing about it. This isn't a new issue; it comes up at the beginning of every swim season and slowly goes away as people realize it's an isolated issue...
     
  9. 24around

    24around New Member

    Joined:
    Mar 9, 2006
    Messages:
    54
    Likes Received:
    0
    I say Kudos to Staci and all the other board members for their decision to sell outside memberships! Because of their decision each year, our HOA dues have not increased significantly (at least not to pay for pool usage) and they have raised the funding required to provide canopies and diving boards, etc., etc., etc. I have definately found comfort under the shade of cover!

    For those of you complaining about having to wait to be admitted to the pool, I suspect you will be complaining again when we no longer have outside memberships and our dues are increased in order to pay for maintaining or replacing those canopies!

    So what, you had to wait for admittance into the pool - What ever happened to human kindness? And ban non-residence use on Holidays? Geez, you people are hardcore! Where's the love........?

    Of course, we could ban non-resident use and become like Ashburn Farm - Their residents have to pay dues over and above HOA fees each year for access to their pools (~$150+ per yr.) I for one will "suffer" through a wait line for one or two days per season in order to avoid having to pay extra.

    So, again Kudos to those who made the decision to sell outside memberships! The $50 grand plus per year, is well worth it in my opinion!!
     
  10. flynnibus

    flynnibus Well-Known Member Forum Staff

    Joined:
    Oct 29, 2002
    Messages:
    5,358
    Likes Received:
    250
    You did because you skipped over the important part

    They know we have capacity, a valuable asset, and each year they evaluate if its in the community's best interest to sell some of that capacity. Their decisions are based on the actual pool pass distribution and actual pool USAGE as well as budget needs.

    The outside pass program has raised huge sums of money for the community with minimal impact. The 500 home item was to highlight the fact a significant portion of the community has no interest at all in using the pools.

    The outside pass program (as stated several times) is re-evaluated every year based on the actual pool information.

    If the concern is over the pools being over-capacity.. start looking at your neighbors and how many there are.. not just the pass program. Think we need more pools? Start lobbying your neighbors to pay for the loans to build them. The developer who built the originals surely isn't going to add anymore.
     
  11. jdhauer

    jdhauer Active Member

    Joined:
    May 27, 2003
    Messages:
    359
    Likes Received:
    25
    How is pool usage measured?
     
  12. msflynn

    msflynn New Member

    Joined:
    Jul 15, 2002
    Messages:
    1,095
    Likes Received:
    2
    the gaurds need to keep a head count of the number of people in the pool every other hour that the pool is open. Just like they do all the chlorine level checks at the same time they need to record the number of people in the pool at that time, it is county regulations. On days when things are busier like this past Monday they will do more regular counts (at the HOA request) such as every 1/2 hour or hour to keep from going way over the bather load and or to continue to allow members in. These number must be reported to the county health department so there is a record for each year and each pool and the helath department does do random checks through out the season to make sure these records are being kept and are accurate.


    Staci
     
  13. vacliff

    vacliff "You shouldn't say that."

    Joined:
    Nov 14, 2002
    Messages:
    5,281
    Likes Received:
    344
    I have one disappointment with the selling of outside memberships......the fact that we didn't sell more.
     
  14. Homer Simpson

    Homer Simpson New Member

    Joined:
    Mar 12, 2002
    Messages:
    1,361
    Likes Received:
    0
    I don't buy the discrimination angle. It's a private pool you can do what you want unless it's against race, etc.... You just have to disclose it next year when you sell.

    Kings Dominion closed itself to Season Pass holders and ticket sales for special groups all the time. It's the same thing as closing the pool to outside members on certain days.

    I think it's kind of obvious we will need more pools. When does SW build out? Maybe the revenue from the outsiders should go to building a new pool.

    Linux: These forums are a community discussion and I think it's a usefull tool for the Board members to guage the owners. Particpating in these forums is like community service for those who can't attend meetings or committes due to work or daycare issues. Sure some of the discussions are not valueable but the ones on the speeding, lights, pools and zoning are. These forums aren't just entertainment, they are the town meeting of the 21st century. We just need everyone to get onboard and particpate.
     
  15. gator

    gator New Member

    Joined:
    Aug 3, 2005
    Messages:
    140
    Likes Received:
    0
    Cliff, talk about a thumb to the eye, geez. But you are right, typically the pools are not overcroweded, except for a few days throughout the year. If selling the outside memberships keeps our dues down, it is a small price to pay once or twice a year. I believe the pools have phones, call ahead and see if they are at capacity on those holiday weekends. I would also like to say thanks to vacliff, Mr. Linux and Staci for keeping their cool and addressing the issue with facts. Thanks again for taking care of our neighborhood.

    Any idea for next years pool passes. If they are going to have picture on them, why not add a bar code or such so that they can be scanned for accounting purposes. They could be used to make sure the pools didn't go over capacity. Just an idea.
     
  16. BelindaTH

    BelindaTH New Member

    Joined:
    Jan 25, 2004
    Messages:
    365
    Likes Received:
    2
    I too want to thank Cliff, Mr. Linux, and Staci. Keep up the good work.
     
  17. GCyr

    GCyr New Member

    Joined:
    Jul 10, 2002
    Messages:
    459
    Likes Received:
    0
    How about if the pools don't allow outside members during holiday weekends just as the amusement parks and movie theaters don't allow certain pass holders on certain days?

     
  18. joy

    joy New Member

    Joined:
    Feb 12, 2002
    Messages:
    516
    Likes Received:
    2
    One thing I've noticed now that I have relatives at Ashburn Farm and Ashburn Village is that they charge for guest entries every time. We all get 10 free guests each year that we stock up. I really appreciate this. However, I wonder if it brings up capacity at our pools? It would be interesting to count the number of guests versus household memberships. Do we have that?

    One other point of interest, I was at the outdoor pool at the Ashburn Village Sports Pavilion on Sunday and it was nearly empty. I passed by Southern Walk on the way and it was slammed. I attributed this mostly to the indoor pool in Ashburn Village being open year-round, so it's no biggie that the outdoor pools are now open.
     
  19. Homer Simpson

    Homer Simpson New Member

    Joined:
    Mar 12, 2002
    Messages:
    1,361
    Likes Received:
    0
    Although I think the overcrowding this weekend was due to the holiday, I'd be interested in seeing what the numbers are for the season. I'm sure the pools follow a density like Kings Dominion did, peaking on Holidays, Fri, Sat and Sun. Overall, I'd expect to see an increase each year in daily numbers. Guess you just need to treat it like the beach, pack a lunch and go early.
     
  20. msflynn

    msflynn New Member

    Joined:
    Jul 15, 2002
    Messages:
    1,095
    Likes Received:
    2
    If I actually thought that the teenagers that are our gaurds could handle this with a great success rate that would be a good option. However it is much more realistic to just wait to start the outside membrships until after 4th of July then it is to have the guards remember certain dates that certain people can not come in, but that will greatly reduce the number of people that would be buying the memberships and thus any financial advantage these memberships bring. That said, there are a lot of assumptions that this is how the whole summer is going to be. At this point I am not willing to base what we are doing next year on one hour and half period of time that things were busy, especially when everyting I am seeing and is recorded shows that outside membership had nothing to do with the capacityi issues. If this is the way the WHOLE summer is I agree we need to consider other options but until that time there is not anything I can do for this summer but track outside members impact and make sure the gaurds are inforcing the rules that are in place for them (ie they are not allowed at Summerbrooke)

    Staci
     

Share This Page