Notice Verizon HQ

Doesn't surprise me that both camps disagree about the salary part. No one is going to release the actual salary data for each individual. One camp is going to say they are highly paid and the other camp is gonna say they are paid lower than what the other says. Who are we to believe?

But that salary of 60K to 77K before OT is pretty good for that type of position....Benefits typically are roughly around 40% of a person's salary. So if someone is making 100K, the benefits are roughly around 40K...so those benefits are probably about right. If the workers are paid less, the value of the benefits are lower...but if higher salary, then benefit value is higher.

I see the fight between both camps is also about compensation levels.

 

I used to work at Microsoft and that was pretty much understood. Do your job and like it, because there are 18 people lined up at the door who would take it in a heartbeat. Our pay was decent. Our benefits were good (I'd say "great" until the stock went from $110 to $20). But the bottom line is the same. Is it worth it to you? Stay and do your thing. Is it not? Don't let the door hit you on the way out... and don't let it hit the guy who is coming in behind you to take over your office.

 

And we have Obama-care to thank for this.

(says sharse who has over 15 years experience in the benefits consulting industry, and used to work for the firm that conducts the most widely quoted and respected surveys on said topic...)

 

While I agree with your premise that $12 per month is RIDICULOUSLY low (most families pay a few hundred a month or more!) I have to say that I used to work in the benefits department for Microsoft in Redmond. (Building 9, then I was moved to Building 20, then Building 26 for anyone who happens to care. :indiff2: .) MSFT employees have always payed a bit out of their paychecks for their insurance.

 

Sharse- I visited that friend of mine in Seattle who worked for Microsoft and he took me on a tour of the campus and showed me all the various buildings and they had numbers to each of them. Additionally, he said that Bill Gates was routinely moved around to keep potential assassins or kidnappers guessing where he might be. Thought that was pretty smart to do.

Im told that in the "heady" days of MSFT, the benefits package was pretty rich for the employees but they have come down significantly due to the fact that the company is just like any other company nowadays. Stock price also had lot to do with it too along with the rising health care costs.

 

It's a common theme across human history. Farmers who plowed their fields by hand ending up being swallowed whole by competitors dwarfing their output through technology, American car manufacturers bested by foriegn imports time and time again, huge internet service providers going belly up as broadband access replaced the need for dial up services. All stemming from a basic laws of the land - survival of the fittest in response to market demand.

You state that it's easy for 'us' to be dismissive of that fact until we are affected. I proffer that your statement is an easy card to play in an attempt to solicit the 'red white and blue' sentiment and legislate imaginary borders to remove competition - trying to override the natural laws of economy. Does your car, tv, can of refried beans offer a different story?

I worked on a contract where the primary development team for a component of the application was located in India. Sure, no-one was happy that there were a dozen guys coding overseas and all kinds of colorful commentary ensued. In the end it completed without much fanfare and didn't have the anticipated impact.

The true weakness of that attempt, in my exclusive opinion, was the inability to articulate the spirit of the application to the engineers: how people used it here in the US, how it fit in with the long-range strategy for the organization, how it enhanced capabilities of related processes - all culture-based reasons, and not something that is easily overcome. This lack of understanding was written all over the app and it's lack of extensibility.

I took something away from that and used it to strengthen my personal committment to continued education and personal growth in areas that I see being key points in the long run - with full understanding that what I am doing today will eventually be standardized and mashed into a repeatable process and handed off to some other part of the world, destined for a factory of some sort.

I know I risk massive flaming for that stance, and in anticipation of recieving that I will state that I served for this country - locked in a tube for the US Submarine force for a few years chasing the bad guys around (or chasing our tails if nothing was going on). The freedom this country provides for me to be out here and try and fail and try again I cherish more than I can ever articulate. I am 100% committed to the US and what it stands for. For me, it means never slowing down, never backing down, and always striving to be better, faster, stronger, & smarter - and making that a commitment for life. It's how we were founded and that will continue to be our strength in the long run. That being said, I want the rest of the planet to be free to join in on the action as well... I believe in this enough to want it to spread around a bit.

Sorry for the diatribe. This subject touches me quite a bit, I've seen so many people simply kick-back in complacency and feel like the gravy train will never end... as if they graduate and that one hot skillset is supposed to carry them through forever. When it does stop, it's always 'someone else's fault'. History itself provides a compelling reason to think otherwise and, IMO, our minds are meant for so much more than that limited approach.

thanks...

 

Interesting. That's a new thing... they didn't do that back when I was there. He was in Building 8 in the executive suite known as BOOP. Everyone knew where it was, but you had to go through extra security to get INSIDE the BOOP. That said, I occasionally saw Bill downstairs in the Building 8 cafeteria grabbing lunch by himself. I guess in the 90s they didn't worry as much about his security.

 

In this case, it seems the Abominable Snowman is real, so my answer is yes. Or, I would seek employment elsewhere. It's my responsibility to prove to the company that I am worth what they're paying me.

It sounded to me that Verizon could train replacement workers in a relatively short period of time, so the striking workers don't really have a unique skill set to give them any bargaining power. In an economic sense, the market price for a phone worker has decreased and Verizon doesn't want to keep paying the old higher price. If I'm a phone worker, I have to either broaden my skill set to be able to command the same compensation or, if I believe Verizon is simply out to screw it workers, I go find another company. But if the market price for a phone worker really has decreased, I should then find similar compensation packages at other companies for my services.

 

Hooray! Love it! I completely agree. We have the freedom to work hard to achieve our personal goals. We also have the freedom to do the bare minimum in order to survive. Personal choice. Personal responsibility. You reap what you sow.

(ps... my hubby, rharse as he's known here on the forum, was a submariner, as well!)

 

Eating BY himself?? No one ate with him? Wonder why?!?

 

People, yes I pay 12.00 a month for ins with a 1000.00 ded I DON"T WORK FOR VERIZON, so pease stop stating this is verizon's Health Ins

 

I thought that MSFT didn't pay anything for health until 2013. They were the gold standard. There were a lot of news stories late last year about the changes that MSFT was making (having employees pay starting in 2013)

http://www.zdnet.com/blog/microsoft...loyee-benefits-and-more-news-of-the-week/7609

http://bit.ly/aXijGP - Health care: Microsoft ending 100% coverage for employees

I go to campus every year for the MVP summit and really enjoy that entire area.

I do agree with everyone else, if someone only pays $12/month that is great.

Having said that a lot of companies are using the economy as an excuse to screw workers. I see big defense contractors that are making money and still refusing to spend a few thousand dollars to send folks to training or major conferences but expect them to stay current. Luckily I work for a smaller company right now and don't have to deal with that mentality.

Thanks

Mike

 

When you have as much as 20% real unemployment, you're lucky to have a job. Cobra is a lot more expensive.

 

I work in DC and my firm is now on day 3 of no circuits and no inbound calling. My entire office (250+/- attorneys), no inbound calls. Verizon can't get it fixed. In my 5 years here this has never hapenned, not once. Imagine the economic consequences to us alone (and yes, I realize no one has any pity for attorneys).

I just saw a WSJ article about "sabotage" by strikers and that Verizon is calling the FBI to investigate. If true, I hope folks are prosecuted to the max. Based on what I've read, I have zero sympathy for the strikers and hope every single one of them is replaced, and those who broke the law jailed.

Makes me want to stand across the street from them with a sign saying "go back to work" . . .

Now, back to my unusually quiet office . . .

 

While training benefits are nice and have been fairly consistent across my employment history, I'm wondering if this scenario really consitutes folks getting screwed?

My take is that I'm employed to provide a set of services, and my company and their clients expect me to have the skills necessary to carry out those services. None of my jobs have ever been provided based on a promise or assumption that "I will learn and do well if you pay my salary AND the training expense." - only that "I will do well, period". My company my like my work and decide that it's beneficial and cost-effective to provide training to increase my value based on prior performance, but ultimately it's my repsonsibility to ensure my own survival. (which i do to the tune of $313 a credit at GMU)

If the company can hire more qualified indvidiuals at or around the same salary and save the shareholders the training overhead, shouldn't they be free to do so? (high level theoretical question, understood that turnover and transition costs are huge and high-risk)

I often use an analogy of calling a plumber repair a leak, and when he arrives he wants me to provide him a pipe wrech to do the job. I expect that to be part of the package when I hire him.

 

http://www.wtae.com/r/28846881/detail.html#ixzz1UpxXvTnU

 

Not true - there are co-pays for everything and the co-pay prices go up every year. Plus, it's very restrictive insurance with a limited set of doctors and coverage and many procedures are only paid at 50 or 60% so there are always out-of-pocket insurance expenses every year. Yes, it is better than some but nobody's getting a free ride.

The striking workers are from the land-line and FIOS division. The land-line division has been losing customers, yes, but they are simply moving over to Verizon's wireless division which is extremely profitable. The FIOS division is profitable, not at the very high margins of wireless but it is still profitable and it is still a core component of Verizon and an important foundation of their customer base.

Many of these workers have been with Verizon for 11+ years and are at the higher end of the earning bracket due to their experience and professionalism. They do believe in and value the company. Verizon has already done many things over the last four or five years to get rid of them largely because they can in this economic climate. There have already been pay cuts. The workers are constantly monitored, told to work faster, take short cuts. Every month Verizon asks workers to take an early out so they can hire someone else for less money. There are many unreasonable quotas to meet each week and if they don't meet them, they can be suspended without pay for as many as 10 days. There have been a lot of suspensions. AND several of these quotas are measured by a system that management readily admits is inaccurate. Verizon execs have been very successful at creating a hostile work environment.

So, KOAS, - Verizon has been hiring for the last year - and they pay the new workers $10/hr. and you'll crawl through attics, work in dirty houses, move furniture, deal with angry pets that people don't put away, lay cable through yards, climb poles, drill through bricks, run wire through walls without ever hitting utility lines, know all the wiring/electrical/computer/FIOS configuration of a house you've never seen before - and you have to know all that even though the homeowner doesn't know it - AND you were supposed to do it all yesterday!!! PLUS you have to account for every minute of your day to your supervisor. If you still want a job, they are hiring.



I was in the IT field for many years and if the software/computer/IT workers had had a union you better believe they would have gone on strike to prevent all their jobs from being outsourced overseas! But they had no tools with which to negotiate.

I think a lot of the Verizon workers feel they have already made some concessions. Their pay is down, their costs are up and job stress is the highest its ever been but corporate america profits are at an all time high. They are fighting for their jobs but also to send a message to big business for all workers, for everyone, not just themselves. They know it's tough out there for everyone right now.

I, for one, support the union. I support the strike. The Communication Workers of America union has been around for 63 years - my grandmother was a member when she was a telephone operator in the 1940's. Check it out: http://www.cwa-union.org/