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Oppose to the New Gas Station by Harris Teeter in Broadlands

Discussion in 'Broadlands Community Issues' started by OSimpson, Jun 18, 2016.

  1. vacliff

    vacliff "You shouldn't say that."

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    A couple of points about this application and responses to a couple of concerns.
    The removal of the Commuter Parking area and conversion to gas pumps will have a net result of increasing the shopping center's parking spots.
    The Commuter Lot that these spaces will be reallocated to will be vastly improved. Most of the spaces allocated to the Bank of America are located on the sides of the building, not the area in front.
    The Planning Commission also had concerns about the safety of the current bad intersection at the corner of the Harris Teeter and Bank of America. This will be improved by additional curbing installed to limit the access to the travel lane in this area.
    It is not surprising that a store employee might not know about this application. Notification would have most likely gone to the owner of the store space, not to all of the employees. It is a requirement of the county that applicants notify adjacent property owners and must provide proof that such notification was done. If a business is a tenant in the shopping center and not the owner of the property, then the owner, not the tenant, is notified.
    I would hope pedestrians/children at the shopping center would use the sidewalks.
    Why does Harris Teeter want gas pumps? My guess is because grocery store/gas pumps affiliations are a growing trend in the industry. I suspect grocery stores see profits in keeping customer's gas money. I know I have always taken advantage of the 10 cents/$100 spent discounts that Safeway and Giant/Shell offered.
     
    latka likes this.
  2. OSimpson

    OSimpson Certified Master Naturalist

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    So it sounds like if BofA owns their building they were notified. I am guessing the rest of the small businesses on the side of HT are all tenants not owners so they were not notified since Van Metre is the owner???
     
  3. vacliff

    vacliff "You shouldn't say that."

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    I have no idea who was notified. I imagine it is part of the county records that could be looked up, or VM could be asked.
     
  4. OSimpson

    OSimpson Certified Master Naturalist

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    HT store manager was not aware of it when I asked as well - and he gave me a regional manager's contact who was also not aware of this request. Here is her reply below.

    "Mrs. Simpson,

    I also responded to your e mail last week stating that I would forward your concerns to our director of petroleum. Unfortunately, at my level I was not aware of the the permitting request. I have forwarded you concerns.

    Sincerely,

    Renee Kifus
    Harris Teeter Supermarkets LLC
    E Mail: rkifus@ harristeeter.com"
     
  5. flynnibus

    flynnibus Well-Known Member Forum Staff

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    This still stands as one of the most odd-ball strip malls put together. Planting the gas station there will just continue the trend of wonky designs.

    Cliff while there may be a net gain on paper for parking... I doubt it comes out that way in practice. The commuter lot also doubles as shopping center lot. They aren't going to replace every parking spot AND more. I assume the commuter spots just aren't counted in the shopping center spots.. which is just creative accounting for this conversation.
     
  6. OSimpson

    OSimpson Certified Master Naturalist

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    I just wanted to correct the meeting information for the Board of Supervisors. I was wrong thinking that it was going to be tomorrow.

    Public Hearing is on Wed., April 14th - not tomorrow.
    Voting will not take place at this meeting. My understanding is that voting will be done at the October meeting.
     
  7. vacliff

    vacliff "You shouldn't say that."

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    The Loudoun county Board of Supervisors will hold a Public Hearing on this item tomorrow. This is the opportunity for members of the public to address the Board about this application. Although the Board does not generally vote on applications at Public Hearing, they can suspend the rules and vote. Generally, an application like this will be forwarded to a business meeting for action or to the Transportation and Land Use Committee if more work needs to be done to the application.
     
  8. OSimpson

    OSimpson Certified Master Naturalist

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    I am told by Supervisor Meyer's aid that he asked Van Metre to move the gas station to Mooreview Parkway parking lot.
     
  9. OSimpson

    OSimpson Certified Master Naturalist

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    And the answer was quickly "No".. I am told.
     
  10. OSimpson

    OSimpson Certified Master Naturalist

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    Bank of America does not own the building at the Southern Walk Plaza - they are leasing it. So they were not notified. Spoke with the manager... her reaction... I wish I could record it...
     
  11. OSimpson

    OSimpson Certified Master Naturalist

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    Video capture from the meeting that is discussing the gas station. Only the car/ pedestrian traffic and parking issues were brought up. I didn't have the time in 2.30 min to include more. Will be working on adding the air pollution related health concerns and potentially water pollution health concerns.

     
    flynnibus likes this.
  12. flynnibus

    flynnibus Well-Known Member Forum Staff

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    Thank you for posting this Oya.
     
  13. OSimpson

    OSimpson Certified Master Naturalist

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    No problem - didn't have time to address the pollution problem. Everyone focused on the traffic, parking... I will do more research on the added pollution.

    Also traffic, parking, and pedestrian flow should be looked at as it is now instead of more of the mentioning of studies, and guidelines - it's been very briefly addressed. For example, they are adding crossing from VM to Bank side... how is that any help, people were walking anyway... did anyone think about the cars coming in and out of the ATM - that's another angle to the jungle.

    Parking space is tight for the other small businesses in this section, where not only customers, employees park too. So add all that up. When merchants complained about excessive commuter parking which was effecting their business they were given a paper with a note saying they maybe towed by Van Metre and asked to put it on those cars. Is that OK? Is that legal? I usually see a sign that says you will be towed ..... and there is a number to call.

    In addition there was a question to the applicant which was never answered during the meeting...

    I have to say, in some occasions I did work with Van Metre and got their support. In this situation, what's being done isn't exactly best for the shoppers, small businesses, people who lives only under 400 feet away and the environment. Obviously, if putting a gas station was part of the original plan, because it was going to be profitable, the site would have been designed more like the other centers - but in this situation it is wrong. At the annual meeting we were told that Harris Teeter asked for this and Harris Teeter has to be told that it is wrong...
     
  14. flynnibus

    flynnibus Well-Known Member Forum Staff

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    Oya, I doubt you'll win any mindshare trying to advocate 'gas stations are evil' -- they are a necessity of our car culture and everyone uses them and wants them to be convenient. (and as noted by Meyers, south of Broadlands is a gas station DESERT). Trying to convince people that gas stations don't belong in our area is futile. Trying to argue the gas station is too close to other residential is futile when existing convention and other examples are much closer and more exposed. IMO the fight has to be this will be a net negative and the location is poor because it compromises too much.

    The parking further to the west is much worse.. clearly the BoA site is the one that gets the total shaft in this arrangement. I would only expect this to impact like 10 parking spots as it matters for the businesses around the corner from HT. It's the bank that will need to stare right out their window at a gas station basically right in their field of view.. and will have to deal with the commotion of coming/going and having its most convenient parking choked.

    What was said in the meeting, but not re-enforced was VM was contract obligated to not touch that parking out in front of HT. So not sure why Meyers and Buona kept beating that horse.

    Plus, if those traffic improvements were so needed in the shopping center... why isn't VM doing it already to remove a safety hazard in their shopping center?? That's just a fake carrot they are throwing out to why this exception is good. VM is totally 'buying' this exception with the commuter lot improvements.

    Topics I can't imagine aren't addressed (and what I'd argue)

    - Traffic flow e/w there is already tight and constrained.. now this will add people turning in/out of the pump lanes basically DIRECTLY into the throughway? There isn't much space there at all. That parking area is already awkward for reasons I can't pin down. Every other gas station I am aware of in the area has curbs to funnel traffic in and out of entrances.. yet here there is no traffic control at all.

    - I still can't believe with all the talk about traffic ingress/egress.... they don't mention at all that the gas station isn't directly accessible... only accessible by driving THROUGH an already congested parking area. It's like approving a shopping center that you can only get to by driving through a neighborhood or someone else's lot.

    - The other example of a gas station in the shopping center in the area is basically the same size (3 rows of pump and one building row). That area for the gas station is roughly 175ftx100ft including the canopy and travel lanes around it. The location at SouthernWalk is about 20ft shallower in both dimensions AND feeds directly into the path of travel. Why not address this 'tight' space with zero buffer between customers moving in/out of pump lanes and through traffic?

    Another example up in Ashbrook Commons is of a similar size to the proposed one (if you ignore the building) but has buffers and curbs all the way around it.

    Have they said at all where the signage would go for the place? Can't imagine a gas station without price signs visible from the major road...
     
  15. nadir

    nadir New Member

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  16. OSimpson

    OSimpson Certified Master Naturalist

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    Force fitting continues. Thanks for the update. My opposition will not change. No gas station at this shopping center. HT needs to find another method to compete with itself and Wegmans. VM should not be afraid to say no.

    Nice having a huge Broadlands sign with a leaf, nature preserve and a gas station... Now this can mean 4 gas station for Broadlands. Sunoco, Safeway (eventually) , VM on Broadlands Blvd... as the county invests in metro for public transportation..... surrounding communities with gas station makes no sense. Lowering the quality of living done well... one piece meal at a time.

    The same traffic from the same direction will be coming to this gas station passing by the previous location....

    Also, 14 fueling station is nothing but "small" as it was referred to during the board meeting. Sunoco has 12, Safeway had 14, Exxon in Ashburn Farm has 12, Exxon A Plus has 10, 711 on Ashburn Village has 12, Exxon on Ryan Park has 16.

    Please send an e-mail to the board of supervisors again to oppose if you agree at bos@loudoun.gov. If you don't, that's fine too. I am not looking for an argument.
     
  17. nadir

    nadir New Member

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    Was wondering if you could provide the source for the "VM on Broadlands Blvd" gas station you have cited several times previously. I am unaware of what the property at the NW corner of Claiborne and Broadlands Blvd was originally zoned for, but the rezoning application for that property mentions nothing about a gas station.
     
  18. OSimpson

    OSimpson Certified Master Naturalist

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    It was mentioned during the presentation at the HOA annual meeting that as part of the plan VM is seeking for a gas station company as a tenant I guess. Just like a grocery store they are seeking for as a tenant as well.

    So, it is a possibility.
     
  19. jbrown43

    jbrown43 New Member

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    Can't wait for this to open up.

    Broadlands and Brambelton need a gas station.

    Sorry Oya.
     
  20. vacliff

    vacliff "You shouldn't say that."

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    The land is zoned PDOP (Planned Development Office Park) that allows a number of uses. Here is what the current plan is for that property:
    Three two story office buildings, gas station, restaurant pad site. These uses are allowed with current zoning.
    There is a rezoning application filed to allow a 3 story self storage facility and a grocery store.
    There is enough land available to build more office buildings when demand is there.
     
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