Broadlands Hospital

Okay, Lee, let's have it your way. You want OTHERS, namely the private individuals who are stockholders of HCA, to locate their hospital in an area where they will not be able to make a profit. Fine.

Are YOU willing to relocate your business to the poor neighborhoods of D.C. and design homes for the working class? You love design, right? There's probably no place with a greater need for good design than poor neighborhoods. So can we count on YOU to help those with no money and no insurance, or do you just want OTHERS to sacrifice for the common good?

 

WRONG! Wrong premise Lee, we will disagree on this point. You have not responded to any of my previous comments about insurance and the effects competition provide. You continue to stay on your myopic course which is your prerogative, but don't make a leaping assumption that "we know".

I am not sure how to respond to your conclusion that all this leads to a need for hospitals in Africa where real health problems are.

It's hard to debate about things I don't understand.

 

There is a bigger need for health care in Africa then here so that wipes out the argument that we need this hospital more. I am just throwing this out here for debate. This hospital wants to be built for the money and the people that can pay for it out of my tax dollars and the tax dollars that pay for most of the high premiums from throughout this country. So it becomes an hospital for the few here in northern Virginia. Not an hospital that will do the most good for the world only for those that have insurance to pay for it.

 

Lee - there you go AGAIN with more fear-mongering.

What the holly cow are you talking about?

We have BCBS PPO and we CHOOSE to leave Loudoun and head to Reston or Bethesda. Inova has screwed up too many times while under their care . Keep in mind fron 2004-07 our insurance paid > 1.46Million in claims - if HCA was here that would have been taxable income for the county.

I am pretty sure that both Inova & HCA will treat patients regardless of their financial situtation - thus delays in ER/ED.

 

Lee, have I finally found something to silence you?! You keep dodging my question. It is clear that poor families in D.C. could benefit more from your services than rich doctors out here. Do you just design for the money, you know, like the hospital? I think your service would do the most good in poor areas of D.C., not only for those that have the money to pay you.

So are you going to move your office to D.C.? Are you going to start designing homes for poor people who really need your help?

 

thepea2001, I agree with you there. Federal laws require that hospitals provide a certain level of emergency care regardless of a particular patient's insurance status or ability to pay. So, I am sure this planned hospital would be no different. However, any hospital that has a high percentage of uninsured patients would not stay open for long. I doubt that would happen with the planned facility being located in the middle of such an affluent area.

We have had nothing but the best experiences with Loudoun Hospital and Inova. However, even with another new hospital in Loudoun (Loudoun Hospital itself is new), I am sure some people would continue to seek out specialists, etc. in Arlington, DC, Fairfax, and Maryland.

 

Me be silent, I think that is your name Some of the best older beautiful homes are in the worse areas of a city. Lets take DC for example Georgetown has the same beautiful homes that some of the worse areas of DC has. Just the Georgetown homes are just kept up. It is not so much a building or design problem as it is an social problem. Many of the poor actually live in the same designed homes as the rich in DC. So the real solution is how do you make someone feel good about themselves and be able to afford the place they live in????? Answer that and we go a long ways to solving the problem you are talking about Mr Silence. It is not an design problem they already have the design and far better design then most of Americas Suburbs and far better built. It is a maintenance problem where the poor can afford to keep what they have and feel good about themselves. No more no less. Actually the design of the suburbs of America are far worse then in our cities as we are now seeing in our suburbs. We build a lot of junk in the suburbs surrounded with the so called green space. That green space does not make the new suburban homes better. It just clouds up the picture.

 

Well said Lee! :happyclap:

 

Nice dodge and very touchy feely, Lee. But here's the thing. You have called for HCA to lose money by operating in areas where people cannot afford their services. In fact, you have implied that they are sinister or evil if they do not do this.

My question remains. Are you willing to do what you want HCA to do--are you willing to help the poor afford their homes? Are you willing to donate your time, services and money to make sure this happens?

Or are you like the typical, WELL-MEANING liberal who likes to "feel" compassionate by expecting others to help the poor (i.e. take someone else's tax money and give to the poor through some bureaucratic government program) while refusing to do it with your own money?

 

I'm disappointed that you forgot to add your typical "Marxist/Socialist, have contributed to the death of more people than anybody in the history of the world, etc" tag line in your response to Lee. Your inner Bill O'Reilly is surfacing again (I know, I know -- you don't watch him, you don't like him -- amazing how much you sound like him, though).

 

Madcat, you have anything substantive to add to this? It would be constructive if you, for once, could explain why you stand by liberal theology.

Notice a few things here:
1. You never intellectually answer for your ideology. And yes, modern liberalism is rooted in Marxism and even fascist thought. Tell me how the class warfare rhetoric and supposed compassion that Senators Clinton and Obama (who I like), not to mention the Republican candidates as well half the time, espouse differs from this Marxist dictum: from those according to their ability to those according to their need. Do the research. And please tell me how confiscating money from one group to give to another is compassionate in your eyes.

2. Note that I do not disparage the "intentions" of liberal thinking. I said it was WELL MEANING (that's why I intentionally put it in caps). I do believe that liberals have good intentions; they are just misguided.

3. Let's say I come to your house and take a $20 bill off your table. Then I take it with me and see someone who needs help. I then give that $20 to some bureaucrat who runs a government program and ask them to help that person. Does that make me compassionate?

4. Funny how YOU know Bill O'Reilly so well and claim that he somehow speaks for me. I am on record repeatedly as saying that I think O'Reilly and Hannity are blowhards. When watching election results, I watch CNN because I think their analysis is better and more even-handed. I find it charming that those who hate Fox News seem to wacth it more than I do!

5. Read the context of my post. Lee had disparaged a for-profit company, HCA, as evil (wow, where do you hear that rhetoric coming from!) because they intend to run a hospital in a place where they can, um, make a profit versus setting up shop in Africa. I merely challenged Lee to apply HIS LOGIC to himself--would HE be willing to set up his business i an area where he couldn't make money? Funny how silent he's been.

And that's my main problem with liberal thought. Liberals have good hearts and want to help people. But they always want government to do it. And the only way government can do it is to take someone else's money and give it away. How many cents of every dollar funneled through a govt program actually makes it to the person in need?! And once in does, please tell me the govts track record on housing (would you live in a HUD housing project) and poverty. How many trillions of dollars do you want to spend?

The insidious part is that liberals then make people dependent on the government, rather than freeing them to be independent.

I await your answer.

 

I've really been trying to stay out of this thread... but having been in the health care business since 1989, I had to comment on this. When it comes down to the nitty gritty, not-for-profit systems and for-profit systems aren't all that different. First of all, they're all in it to make a buck. They all have employees to pay, they all have buildings to power. Their extra money is just either called a "reserve" or a "profit" but it's there just the same. Don't fool yourself into thinking that a not-for-profit hospital will charge less than a for-profit hospital will. The difference is in the accounting.

And also, don't be fooled into thinking that just because health insurance premiums are high and the cost of an MRI seems astronomical that the providers are tucking away huge margins. They're not. They're trying to stay afloat just like the rest of us. Many people don't realize that some Blue Cross/Blue Shield plans are for profit, some are not. But in the grand scheme of things it doesn't matter. They all operate the same. The only difference is what they call a few of the line items on their balance sheet. Either way they're a "big bad insurance company", right?

 

Nobody has lost their home in Canada or England because they could not afford health care. People every day do here.

Is that fair??????

 

I can understand that the operation of the hospital may not be a whole lot different but what about the impact to the community in the forms of taxes? Won't a for-profit generate much more tax for the county than would a not-for-profit? This aspect could directly impact property owners if it would mean either a decrease tax or at least help prevent steep increases in their taxation.

 

Lee - the blame is more than just the hospitals and in no way am I stating that there aren't some hospital conglomerates out there who over inflate the cost of care. However you have neglected to factor in insurance company/plans, type of care etc.

This is not a simple equation - it is far more complex.

To apply a ubiquitous statement (as you have that) HCA will "suck you dry" is beyond reasonable and more fear-mongering. If HCA is here at least they would generate tax dollars - while Inova sits back and pads their reserves/profits all the while not adding one dime to Loudoun's business tax pool.

Additionally bringing Canada or England into this debate - it is an inappropriate comparison and statement.

 

People are losing their homes primarily because they bought more than they could afford and/or agreed to lousy terms. Let's not blame hospitals or insurance companies for poor decisions that others have made.

Is it fair for those of us who didn't make such decisions to have to pay the mortgage of those who did? Why should the government get involved in the first place? These are personal decisions.

Life isn't fair, Lee. By the way, are you going to answer my question or should I take your silence as an admission that you want others to operate their business at a loss, but you aren't willing to do the same yourself. Is that fair?

 

Actually, Lee, my dear friend, if you do your research you can find names of folks who lost their LIVES in those countries because of inadequate care, waiting lists, etc. Is that fair?

 

WOW, that was just painful. Are we going to get back on topic here about OUR issue? One good thing that this brought about was i had never really thought about the difference between for profit and non-profit except that one pays taxes and the other doesn't. Lee's socialist diatribe lead me to Google the whole thing. Here was the most interesting website I found: http://www.wherethemoneygoes.com/

I have no idea who is behind it, but it isn't flattering for non-profit hospitals. My bottom line is I don't care what the tax status of a hospital is, care for me and my family.

 

I just got a survey phone call about the hospital issue. The number on my caller ID says "Out of area" and "571-000-0000". The surveyer asked if I had heard about a proposal to build a new hospital in "Broadsdale". I don't think he read the script closely.

Anyone else getting these calls?

He said he was going to ask six questions, but the only ones I can recall are:
* Have you heard about the proposed hospital in Broadsdale?
* Do you support it?
* What is your age group (followed by a listing of groups)
* Number of children under age 18 in the house?
* How long have you lived in your house?

--- John B.

 

I've seen 703-000-0000 on my caller ID but don't answer it.