Planning Commission makes their vote to...

Like cause people to read emotion into web forums like these even where none exists.[]

 

and, I mean, there's no emotion vested in the 50+ pages of this forum dedicated to arguing the hospital issue. I mean, no one has made personal attacks, no otherwise sane people have exhibited rabid tendencies; so I can't understand why it would start now....[]

BTW, I don't think HCA has exhibited behavior that would lead me to believe they would say, "oh the board says no. we'll go somewhere else". So I expect, even if the BOS says no, they'll litigate until no options remain or the county runs out of money.

I do think Looney's disinterest in other sites undermines their whole "we need another hospital in Loudoun, and since HCA cares, we want to provide it" premise. WHat he seems to be saying is Loudoun be @#$%, We want our way or nothing.

Yes, I know they already own this land, but there are other parcels out there, and it's not like they'll lose money on the real estate (at least not as much as they've already spent on ad campaigns and lawyers).

 

My guess is that HCA won't look at another site is because they do not believe they will have the volume of business to succeed "somewhere on RTE 50."
I think they got the no vote for one primary reason: They refused to pony up some extra cash for RTE 659 improvements. At the September Planning Commission meeting, it was pointed out that the medical office buildings will generate more traffic than the equivalent amount of office space. HCA was asked if they would be willing to consider contributing more money for the road. They indicated that could be done. However, at this meeting, when asked the same question, HCA said they felt that their contribution that was already in the plan was their "fair share" and would not add any more money to Rte 659 improvements. I think this lost them 2 to 3 votes.

 

Donna...not sure of the reason for a new thread on this. Neil already posted this info over at the other hospital thread. There are some questions still lingering over on the other thread...and I've got some more...where shall we continue?

 

I think the reason for the new thread was that alot of people got tired of reading that old thread, and frankly, my little post was buried where people wouldn't see it. It hardly got any notice at all for a day after I posted it !!



Neil Z.
Resident since 1999

 

I think this is great that we started a Fresh New thread, Jeanne!

What lingering questions??

 

Is there a "backup" plan for the "original" mental health facility requirement? I may be jumping ahead of things but as I understood it, there will be mental health facility within broadlands, HCA or otherwise. HCA was just a way to kill two birds with one stone. OK, maybe that was a poor way to put it...

And please, no abrupt responses...

 

I started this new thread because of some of the reasons mentioned...people were getting tired of reading the some 'ol thing. If there are new questions that have not been addressed "ad naseum" already, I would be more than happy to answer them. However, now that the PC has voted and it is now to be an issue before the BOS, I think those are really the only questions that should be discussed. I am not going to go back over almost 3 years worth of work to start another debate. Jeanne, if HCA and you have new issues to be discussed thats great, it's always refreshing to talk about concerns that haven't already been addressed. I hope nobody takes this as an abrupt response...we don't want any feelings to get hurt.

 

Ok…I’ll pass on the old questions for now….unless, of course, sk8r wants to see them posted. Here are some new ones. Since no one can seem to find where “nightclub” appears under the zoning regs for special exception uses…have you noticed what is acceptable under section 4-303 for PD-OP? How about a sewer pumping station, a utility substation or a water pumping substation? I know, these are about as far fetched as a “nightclub”; however, these uses do appear in black and white and are already approved uses – no special exception required; whereas “nightclub” does not. I guess my question is, Donna…do you have the time, energy and financial backing to fight the next “conglomerate” that comes along? I think Cliff mentioned previously that Wal Mart was looking at the sight prior to their purchase of the current sight near the Dulles Town Center. So, it won’t be a Wal Mart, but it could be something similar.

I have to agree with GCyr’s comment…on any visit over to the medical buildings near Loudoun Hosp, I have never experienced a traffic jam in or out of that area. That was one of the last items used to build the anti-hospital momentum.

With the LC planning staff recommending the Planning Commission reject 16 of the 20 Comp Plan Amendments (including Greenvest’s), what is Loudoun Hospital’s contingency plan for a site along the Route 50 corridor, given that Greenvest was going to donate 50+ acres of their proposed development to LHI for a hospital? (source of recommendation to reject: Loudoun Times Mirror)

Further to AFGM’s comment re: the Park View football player that could not go to Loudoun’s ER since they were full, how frequently is Loudoun Hospital on reroute? Is this something you (Donna) can obtain from Loudoun Hospital? This is in no way to be taken as an attack of you, Donna; however, since you are leading the anti-BRMC movement, we all deserve to know how well (or not) the only hospital in our county can accommodate our needs. With the shortage of flu vaccines, can we be certain that Loudoun Hospital can handle the load of potential patients?

Bob Conors, who has spoken at several of the public hearings in support of BRMC has stated, “Throughout the United States, the number of beds per 1000 population ranges from 1.73 to 4.55. Based on a 2005 projected population of 238,161 persons in Loudoun County, this equates to a current need for between 412 and 1084 beds. The 145 beds provided by Loudoun Healthcare fall far short of the required capacity to meet the needs of Loudoun County.” Given his credentials: a retired Navy healthcare administrator; Fellow, American College of Healthcare Executives (FACHE); Certified Professsional in Healthcare Information Management Systems (CPHIMS); Project Management Professional (PMP); and 8 year resident of Ashburn Village, I think we can consider him a reliable resource.

I have some additional follow-up to Barbara, Zansu and yet, more for you Donna, but I’ll save those for another post. This one appears to be long enough.

 

Well I appreciated the information in the new thread, since I refuse to read the hospital thread.

Marianne

 

Jeanne, I can answer some of your questions, but as I have said during this whole ordeal, I am speaking as a homeowner and not an LHC employee. If you have hospital related questions I suggest you get those answers on your own. As for do I have enough energy to fight the next comglomerate that comes in, I guess it would depend on who that is. I can say, after reading this in several articles, that LHC has not been on reroute for quite some time. As for Bob Conors, I guess one could say if his numbers and stats are true then HCA could still provide those needed beds to this county ...only in a different location. I would like HCA to answer my other post about why they will not consider another location...all of the benefits they have ever stated about providing beds, services, taxes, jobs... could still be done for the county they so desperatly want to be a part of.

 

Jeanne:

I would like to respond to some of your observations:

While I haven't experienced any traffic problems around LHC either, that has not been my experience at either Reston or Fair Oaks. I have run into traffic backups and parking problems at both of those facilities in the past year -- primarily at the medical offices adjacent to the hospital. I think the traffic situation at the proposed BRMC would be more akin to the Fair Oaks patterns than the LHC traffic patterns. As a resident just off Broadlands Blvd, I cringe at the thought of enduring Fair Oaks-type traffic. This has always been an issue for us, not something brought up at the last minute.

As for the hospital beds per resident comment, I don't think you can use county boundaries to determine the ratio you used. If you use number of hospital beds within either a certain driving time (15-20 mins) or distance (10-15 miles), then you should include a proportion of the beds at Reston, Prince WIlliam, Fair Oaks and even Warrenton and Charles Town in your calculations. If you do that, you will see the situation is not as dire as people make it out to be. This is a regional, not a county issue. That is why panels like the Health Services Agency of Northern Virginia exist.

While Cliff was correct in stating that BRMC's apparent lack of support to expand Rte 659 was one of the reasons the PC denied their request, there were many other reasons cited as well. Hopefully someone (Donna?) can post all the dozen or so reasons for denial to this forum so we can all be enlightened.

As several people have stated, the next step is for the BOS to vote on the special exception. I agree with Cliff that the BOS will probably not overturn the PC recommendation, but that is not a sure thing. And there could still be appeals following any BOS decision.

My two cents worth.....

 

People, PLEASE stop about the traffic concerns! Reston hospital is located in a busy area near the Towncenter and several LARGE office complexes. Fair Oaks is located off a major commuting artery. Last time I checked, Broadlands was not a major business hub and Broadlands Blvd certainly does not have the traffic concerns of a Rt 50. Given the propsed size of the BRMC campus, I doubt parking will be an issue either, if approved.

 

T8erman: BRMC would be located on a major commuting artery on the other side--the Greenway. The current Comp Plan envisions the urbanization of the Greenway corridor in order to accomodate the growth our county will contiue to see. I.e., it has to go somewhere, and if we make it vertical on the Greenway, then it can be empty everywhere else. Take a look at the articles posted on LTM and L2day yesterday about the planning staff's initial review of the CPAMs: the only ones they thought should go forward are located in Ashburn and Sterling, including Diamond Lakes--w/o the baseball. The only way the density in that one made sense was with the stadium and the impetus it would give to bringing rail, which the already approved urban density right next door to your community is justified through (and which comes first, the rail or the hi-rises? Well, the current plan put the hi-rises there in "good faith", and Diamond Lakes is more hi-rises). I've been asking since I joined, how fast does your community want to urbanize? It's a darn good question if you think about it.

Barbara Munsey, from South Riding.

 

Urbanize, smurbanize. Your mantra falls on deaf ears here. I for one embrace the rapid growth of this county. And I am a looong time resident who grew up when there use to be less than 5 stoplights in the entire county. For this area, growth has never been a matter of if, it has been a matter of when, and "when" is here!

As far as the traffic concerns, I realize that the Greenway is a major artey as I drive it often. My intent regarding the traffic concern post was for the immediate Broadlands by-ways. IMO, a hospital on the proposed site will not cause any traffic issues that we do not already have!

 

T8erman: Who knew you were a pro-growther! Me too, and that's why I think we need to plan it realistically. I don't think it serves anyone in the county well if we A) continue the policy of attrition that has made the east such a mess in some places, or B) continue to fall for the finger-in-the-dike approach that will put everything in one place, stacked up, and nothing anywhere else. If density, facilities and transportation are only placed in one strip between the airport and Leesburg, how does anyone anywhere else ever get to the existing facilities, or ever get any in closer proximity? Never becomes a self-fulfilling prophecy, if the chicken-or-egg "planning" continues.

You are 100% correct about "not if, but when" and "when is here". "When" got here some time ago. I remember McLean when it looked about like Purcellville, had one blinker-light, had cows and horses w/in blocks of the town center, and there was no Tyson's. There was a mom-and-pop store on a hill way out at 123 and 7 (after driving in the country for some time), and you could see the scaffolding on the National Cathedral small on the horizon from the site. Long time ago, huh?

Barbara Munsey, from South Riding.

 

Barbara, I agree that we need to be smart about growth and IMO, the #1 priority should be the highway infrastructure. Unfortunately, Richmond's allotment (or lack of) of money does not allow us NOVAers to have the roads we need.

Just a side-note, when YOU run for office (wink), remember that your views are here for all to see!

 

T8erman: I agree on the highway infrastructure too. That was the downfall of good planning in Fairfax: they listened to the then-incarnation of "smart" growth (which has always been about cloaking exclusionary planning in the environment, history and quality of life--for the few) and blocked roads in the hope that it would block people. Stupid, to say the least, but there is a method in the madness, and that is that attrition produces a certain amount of blockage to any cohesive planning, which produces spot results for the people driving the attrition bus.

No plans to run for office, although I was approached by two different groups offering financial backing during redistricting. My guess was because I'm vocal, and not because I'd necessarily be great at it. Anyway, can you imagine if I did? Care to make book on how long it would take for someone who thinks I'm Satan's twin sister to decide to shoot me "for the greater good"?

Seriously, I know my views are on record. And they have my name on them. It always makes me laugh when I get an anonymous hate letter out of western Loudoun (usu after I get a letter in the LTM--apparently free speech has different rules depending on which side of rte 15 you're on!): the only reason they can do that is BECAUSE I put my name on what I say, and because I'm in the phone book. IOW, just participating in local government is exciting enough without the added thrill of being an elected target!

Barbara Munsey, from South Riding.

 

This one is for Donna...I'm still waiting to find out who funded your letter you sent out right before the PC hearing last time. I don't think you ever answered that. Actually, I think you decided to take a vacation. Are you booking for the next one now?