Broadlands Hospital

Personally I think the biggest worry will be property values going down. And of course the potential lawsuits from those drop in property values. These lawsuits could even drag in the supporters into it as an class action suit.

This hospital does not have the majority support according to Donna.

Go back to a back issue of the broadlands newsletter when the hospital spokesman would not say what would go in the wooded corner of broadlands blvd and belmont and it could be used for expansion not in the current build out. There are no decent immediate buffer just 6' twigs planted that will take 25 years or more to grow to a decent height to do any good for these 100 foot tall multiple buildings and the potential to go in those saved green areas with even more buildings after asking for and another exemption from the county down the road in the name of public good. Their final build out as cliff says is not written in stone. The land will be pretty much clear cut with not much protection for the homes surrounding the complex.

If those property values do drop I can see lawsuits everywhere against many who supported this boondoggle Right now this complex is close to a million square feet and could surpass it if they build on the saved places. I can tell you that hospital is not saving those two large common areas for the benefit of the broadlands residents it is there for future growth for this hospital and then you could have new two large buildings right on broadlands blvd.

If they wanted to save those two areas for the residents they would of redistribute that land to widen the buffer substantially, instead they left those two areas large enough intact to put future buildings there right on top of broadlands blvd. ANd the spokesperson for the hospital said they would not rule out any future uses they would have in mind for them those parcels. It is in the old broadlands newsletter from I think 2005 or there abouts. If I could find it aging online I will post a link.

Once the hospital gets it's claws in there they will use the benefit for the public to expand no matter what they are telling Cliff and others. That hospital will try to expand beyond now final build out no matter what and they have the land to do it. Perhaps that is the reason they wanted that much acreage even tho they don't need that much for the proposed final build out as they say. There is a potential poisonous snake in the grass here. They have way more land then they need for their final build out and it is not going into the main buffer.

Lee j

 

I don't get it.
Couldn't an office park be JUST AS LIKELY to continue to clear cut and expand as a hospital would be, especially if it's successful? I don't see this as a convincing argument against the hospital or for an office park, unless I'm missing something obvious in all of this rambling.

Oh, and with the failure of the AOL office park, and so many other office parks going up and sitting empty, is there a reason I should have any hopes of ANOTHER office park here in Broadlands being any MORE successful?

Edit: Oh, wait, is that the point? Build an office park so that it will FAIL, like many of the others appear to be doing, and therefore that handles the traffic, safety, and crime issues -- plus the hospital, all in one fell swoop? I get it!


No, wait, no I don't.

 

Does anyone have concrete evidence either way about the effect on property values? Anyone have case studies from other communities/parts of the country?

Aren't homes built along Broadlands Boulevard already discounted given the traffic and commercial buildings there? I don't quite understand why some are making this hospital out to be some evil entity versus other ugly businesses that are already on Broadlands Blvd. and could be built in the future.

So what if they want to use their land? It's THEIR land as far as I can tell. A couple years ago, there was no Wendy's in the Safeway shopping center. Did people living in the townhomes across the street fight against the Wendy's coming in and did they get compensated for it? Wendy's attracts people late at night (including, I bet, some criminals and teenage thugs as some may say), causes a lot of trash to blow around and is right "on top of Broadlands Boulevard." I assume those that lived there knew some business was going to come in there, and I also assume their property values were also discounted.

There are many, many legitimate points against the building of the hospital in this location. So, please, before you pronounce this a "boondoggle" (you know, like your friends in congress, Lee, who pronounced the surge a failure before it began), and make wild accusations (i.e. the usual criminal element having gang wars on the weekends!), stick to reasonable arguments and allow that the other side also has some legitimate points.

 

1. Possibly, it does happen. A new facility, or an existing facility wanting to open a new service, could successfully earn a COPN to build a like service, if they can prove there's a need for it based on the community stats. To successfully challenge it, the challenger would need to prove that they alone can handle the need, or prove there really isn't such a need. I worked for a hospital that successfully challenged, and won, a COPN for cardiac open heart services. They faced down challenges from HCA and Tenet in the process. It can happen. It took them over five years, because HCA and Tenet kept everything tied up in court. (And at the same time, Tenet, HCA, and this hospital along with others entered into a mutually-benficial bargaining unit to negotiate prices with payors, so it's all business -- one minute they're on opposite sides, the next they're shaking hands.)

Otherwise, yes, BRMC could choose to specialize in services for which Inova Loudoun does not claim specialty. Could.

However in my experience, centers of excellence or specialty centers really are more about what's needed in the community -- in a population showing an aging trend, a hospital could end up bleeding money if it built up pediatric services.

2 and 3. My guess is based on the numbers from both Donna and Cliff I've seen, and projected population growth, sure. There should be additional emergency capacity in place well before the capacity reaches 99% at Loudoun. But if I recall, Loudoun claims it's expanding services (ostensibly, my guess is in response to market forces upon which HCA is driving the need for a new hospital...).

4. A for-profit hospital has to have something at the end of the day to give back to shareholders....

And here's my disclosure: truth be told, although I've often said I would like one of the "high paying jobs" this hospital's supposed to bring in, I'll probably be well into a career at another facility long before BRMC is built -- which is why I really am not tied to the location, except that I - like everyone else - want it built in the place that best serves the community with the least amount of negative impact, knowing that it can NEVER be 100% impact-free.

But I can't ignore the fact that HCA does own the land.... And I can't fault them for wanting to build what they build best on it.

 

Oh, and Happy New Year!

 

Silence you win on that point and hopefully we will keep enough troops there so it will stay that way.

I am worried that they will expand into those large tracts they are saving making them look like bookends as to the real skinny twig buffer between them. In spite of what some have been told it does not take a rocket scientist to know those large tracts are build enough for another two 10 story or 100' tall buildings right on broadlands blvd. that are not included in the final build out. As I said before dig up the old newsletter and see what the hospital spoke man said, as he is not ruling out anything. tho he does say they have no present plans for those tracts. MY question if they did not plan to use them beyond the buildout then why are they not redistributed to make the real buffer much deeper??? hmmm

Lee j

 

Because an office park can never use "it is in the public interest" to expand beyond their allowable build out as an hospital can and the hospital is reserving land far beyond what they need for their present build out. To me that is another red flag right there.

Just like they are saying now it is all for the public good, how many office developments can use that?????

As far as it is their land Silence well it is zoned for an office park so they can build that without any special exemptions and then could never expand the office park beyond it's current build out using it is in the public interest.

Lee j

 

Lee, I appreciate that aesthetics, proper design and architecture are important--that is your passion and expertise. I am apalled at how ugly this area has been developed.

But these arguments seem tangential to the core issue of whether this hospital shoud be built. You have no more control over how the hospital uses THEIR LAND than you would for anything else that is going to be built there. So this isn't about whether it should be built, but HOW it should be built...which I think is a separate issue here.

 

Fair enough, but I guess if a hospital can prove a public need, I don't see a reason to demonize them for it. IF there really is a need they're filling, why is that wrong?

OTHER than, because a "hospital doesn't belong in Broadlands"?

 

I never said I don't think we don't need another hospital or demonize them. but build it in the middle of the new recent growth of the last 10 years and that area will also see most of the new growth and is closer to rt 50 who want an hospital but perhaps between brambleton and arcola off loudoun county parkway extension. On land that would not effect already built and future residential and room to grow properly. And it still would be close enough to INOVA to give them a little competition as others want here. It would also be in the middle of all the major new residential growth and future growth not on the edge and also the edge of the sparsely populated and will stay that way with this new board transition zone as it would be if built in the broadlands. Why not build the hospital on land that will have the least effect on existing residential and can grow properly with out the con job they don't know what they are going to do with the extra land in the future or at least try to build something on it. Sounds like typical developer lip service to me.
I don't think they ever thought they would have this many problems building an hospital on that piece of property or they they would bought somewhere else. Of course they will fight to the death because they most likely have the plans and engineering done so to start over would would be very costly and time consuming, which they jumped the gun when they did not have certain approval. Extremely expensive and time consuming gamble they are playing here.

Lee j

 

Cliff - is this what you meant by INOVA healthcare sys & home care Certs for HHS? Is so these are pretty old ...but it looks like the certs are still valid...it also looks like HCA also has a valid cert that expires in a few months.

http://oig.hhs.gov/fraud/cia/agreements/Inova_VNA_home_care_08222006.pdf




http://oig.hhs.gov/fraud/cia/agreements/Inova_Health_Care_Services_11222005.pdf

After it self-disclosed conduct to the OIG, Inova Health System (Inova), Virginia, agreed to pay $125,494 for allegedly violating the Civil Monetary Penalties Law. The OIG alleged that Inova employed two individuals and contracted with a physician that were excluded from participating in Federal health care programs. ​

 

Those are the two cases. I was wondering what led to them and if there were any criminal/civil penalties or fines associated with them.

 

Prisoner Escapes, Shots Fired at Laurel Regional Hospital

http://www.wjla.com/news/stories/0108/484483.html

 

That's it. NO hospital in Broadlands. Also, I propose we shut down Mezza Grill and all restaurants around us because they attract the criminal element as well. I mean, within the past month or so, we had a horrible stabbing at Mezza Grill and an armed robbery at Subway. These restaurants are making our neighborhood too dangerous.

http://www.leesburg2day.com/articles/2007/11/17/news/fp711stabbing111707.txt

 

"OTHER than, because a "hospital doesn't belong in Broadlands"?"




That's pretty much it.

And it took 70+ pages on this thread.

 

Don't forget to close all banks and convenience stores too. And while we are at it, lets close all malls, churches, and schools since that is where most mass-murders take place.

Oh, and Openband should be shutdown as well since they are robbing SW homeowners!

 

Well, I said "OTHER than" for a reason.

I mean, if "Because a hospital doesn't belong in Broadlands" should be enough justification not to build one, then "Because HCA owns the land" should be enough justification to build one. then we're back to square-one, and as this whole thread has been (mostly) dedicated to, sifting out the facts of the situation to find better reasons and rationales one way or the other.

 

Definitely have to get rid of the Post Office!

 

I believe it was reported that Inova paid >10Mill in fines to HHS for the issue of the rental of the Dr's office **EDIT**and later settled for just south of 1M - See link - search to page 35 of 97 pdf....

http://www.oig.hhs.gov/publications/docs/semiannual/2006/SemiannualSpring2006.pdf

 

Okay, so I guess this shot backfired, Lee! Got any other sensational arguments to make. How about this one? People DIE at hospitals so we're going to have dead people all around us